[arm-allstar] timed link disconnect from receiving node

Fri May 17 15:57:56 EDT 2019

Good grief.... there is already an exception!  

Section 97.113(c) follows 97.113(a), therefore it IS an exception.  And
'Regular Basis' is NOT the rebroadcast of weather warnings from NOAA... they
are most certainly NOT on a regular basis; they are random events.
Additionally, because hams are often involved in skywarn and storm spotting
activities, these rebroadcasts can be considered 'life and limb'.  There is
(or at least was) two different products on the market designed to perform
this exact function; the CATAUTO WX-200 and the WX250.  I can't speak for
the rest of you, but I don’t listen to broadcast radio anymore; can't stand
the constant commercials.  Cell phone service is not reliable enough to be
counted on to deliver effective warnings; there have been MANY times when
the only notification of dangerous weather I've received was from the local
repeater.  

I spoke with Riley Hollingworth and Laura Smith about this years ago and
these are the explanations that were given to me.  If someone else got a
different answer after Laura left, then it's their own damn fault for asking
the question.  

Ham radio is self-regulating for the most part, and if it's not explicitly
forbidden in the rules then it's allowed.  Further, if a ham were to be
cited by the FCC about this, there is more than enough ambiguity in the
rules to offer a reasonable explanation. 

If you go asking the ARRL (who are generally worthless these days) or (God
forbid) the FCC, you MIGHT get an answer you don’t like.  If you want more
government in your life, by all means poke the bear - but be prepared to get
bitten. 

Mike
WM4B 

-----Original Message-----
From: ARM-allstar [mailto:arm-allstar-bounces at hamvoip.org] On Behalf Of
"David McGough via ARM-allstar"
Sent: Friday, May 17, 2019 2:03 PM
To: "Lawrence Roney via ARM-allstar"
Cc: David McGough; Lawrence Roney
Subject: Re: [arm-allstar] timed link disconnect from receiving node

Two areas which were pointed out to me by counsel were:

97.113(a)(5)
Communications, on a regular basis, which could reasonably be furnished 
alternatively through other radio services. 

.....So, can you receive a NOAA broadcast directly?? This is another radio
service.  In most areas of the USA, NOAA transmissions on 162.4 thru
162.55 MHz blanket the airwaves with good sites, antennas and KW
transmitters...There are exceptions, however....

It was also pointed out to me that if NOAA is re-transmitted when storms
are nearby or expected, that constitutes "a regular basis."

97.113(c)
..<snip>..Propagation, weather forecasts, and manned spacecraft 
communications retransmissions may not be conducted on a regular basis, 
but only occasionally, as an incident of normal amateur radio 
communications. 

"may not be conducted on a regular basis" --- see above.

"as an incident of normal amateur radio communications" ---- like a NOAA 
receiver is playing in the background when you're talking via a mic over 
ham radio.

Anyhow, *PLEASE* do follow up with counsel (like the ARRL general
counsel). I, too, would like for the FCC stance to be relaxed on NOAA.

73, David KB4FXC

On Fri, 17 May 2019, "Lawrence Roney via ARM-allstar" wrote:

> Hopefully, without turning this into a discussion on FCC rules...
> 
> After doing research and getting opinions from others on implementing a
timed disconnect for a WX rebroadcasting node, it appears that
retransmission of NOAA weather radio is an allowed exception in Part §
97.113(c) as long as the original transmission 1) is intended for use by the
general public, 2) originated from United States Government stations, and 3)
is only conducted occasionally as an incident of normal amateur radio
communications.
> 
> https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/97.113 
> 
> Thanks for everyone's suggestions.  I will pass them along to the owner of
the WX node.
> 
> Lawrence - N6YFN
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> On Fri, 17 May 2019 10:45:07 -0400 (EDT) David McGough <kb4fxc at inttek.net>
wrote: 
> 
> 
> I know re-transmitting NOAA has been a previously debated grey area of the
part 97 rules.  I made some noise about this several years ago and found the
FCC interpretation at that point was that re-transmitting NOAA was not
allowed.
> 
> I recommend that anyone considering NOAA re-transmission should follow up
and get an expert opinion from council---such as from the ARRL general
council.....
> 
> 
> 73, David KB4FXC
> 
> On Thu, 16 May 2019, "Lawrence Roney via ARM-allstar" wrote:
> 
> > We have a club member who was looking to do the same thing with their
> "weather" node.  The node's audio input comes from a receiver that's tuned
to the regional NOAA weather broadcast loop.  As a safeguard, they asked me
if there was a way to force disconnect an incoming call after 3 minutes,
which is enough time to hear the loop broadcast in its entirety, but then
drop the link so it could not inadvertently tie up a repeater.
> > 
> > Thanks Doug,
> > 
> > Lawrence - N6YFN
> > 
> <snip>
> 
> 
> 
> 
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