[arm-allstar] Link to a node for x minutes then disconnect

David McGough kb4fxc at inttek.net
Wed Apr 4 10:45:31 EST 2018 

Hi Stephen,

What you're wanting to do is easily feasible, technically speaking.

>From my understanding, the two sections of the current rules that are the 
kicker are:

97.113(3)(5):
"Communications, on a regular basis, which could reasonably be furnished 
alternatively through other radio services."

............................
Can you direcly receive NOAA transmissions in your area?? If so, NOAA 
broadcasts are already furnished through another radio service.


97.113(c): (last sentence)
"......Propagation, weather forecasts, and manned spacecraft
communications retransmissions may not be conducted on a regular basis,
but only occasionally, as an incident of normal amateur radio
communications."

............................
The "incident of normal amateur radio communications" means the audio 
could be in the background, when a ham was talking into a mic, but even 
then only as an accident.

My interpretation was there there is some "grey area" and I argued this 
with some legal experts. Their answer was that this ground has been 
covered with the FCC, and the answer was: NO.

Please follow up with your ARRL Section manager and get an opinion, etc.

BTW, I don't agree with these rules! But, I can understand why they're 
there.

73, David KB4FXC



On Wed, 4 Apr 2018, Stephen - K1LNX wrote:

> Thanks all, my intent was not to start a debate on this topic, but rather
> to solve a technical challenge. I do however have a misunderstanding of
> 97.113 c:
> 
> (c) No station shall retransmit programs or signals emanating from any type
> > of radio station other than an amateur station
> > <https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=8316e1efbe4ab2409028952c23f115a7&term_occur=8&term_src=Title:47:Chapter:I:Subchapter:D:Part:97:Subpart:B:97.113>,
> > except propagation and weather forecast information intended for use by the
> > general public and originated from United States
> > <https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=974fe48061e86e76cd884bfb06a1dca5&term_occur=1&term_src=Title:47:Chapter:I:Subchapter:D:Part:97:Subpart:B:97.113>
> >  Government stations, and communications, including incidental music,
> > originating on UnitedStates
> > <https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=974fe48061e86e76cd884bfb06a1dca5&term_occur=2&term_src=Title:47:Chapter:I:Subchapter:D:Part:97:Subpart:B:97.113>
> >  Government frequencies between a manned spacecraft
> > <https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=bf5a40d87fcf67bc3ddcc58084bb7c56&term_occur=1&term_src=Title:47:Chapter:I:Subchapter:D:Part:97:Subpart:B:97.113>
> >  and its associated Earth stations. Prior approval for manned spacecraft
> > <https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=bf5a40d87fcf67bc3ddcc58084bb7c56&term_occur=2&term_src=Title:47:Chapter:I:Subchapter:D:Part:97:Subpart:B:97.113>
> >  communications retransmissions must be obtained from the National
> > Aeronautics and Space Administration. Such retransmissions must be for the
> > exclusive use of amateur radio operators. Propagation, weather forecasts,
> > and manned spacecraft
> > <https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=bf5a40d87fcf67bc3ddcc58084bb7c56&term_occur=3&term_src=Title:47:Chapter:I:Subchapter:D:Part:97:Subpart:B:97.113>
> >  communications retransmissions may not be conducted on a regular basis,
> > but only occasionally, as an incident of normal amateur radio
> > communications.
> >
> 
> "except propagation and weather forecast information intended for use by
> the general public and originated from United States Government stations"
> is the verbage I believe that allows this to be permissible under the
> rules?
> 
> I'm not refuting this one way or the other, but I would like to hear some
> opinions on the matter. Doug and/or Dave, if this is not permissible
> discussion then we can end it here as I don't want it to do turn into a
> raging debate, that is not my intent.
> 
> 73
> Stephen
> K1LNX
> 
> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 11:17 AM, "David McGough via arm-allstar" <
> arm-allstar at hamvoip.org> wrote:
> 
> >
> > Hi Everyone,
> >
> > Nope, Doug IS CORRECT about NOAA retransmission.
> >
> > This topic has been discussed previously, but, note that the
> > repeater-builder page is OUT OF DATE. Part 97.113(e) was removed from the
> > FCC Rules several years ago. See the updated rules at the website, below.
> >
> > Basically, the updated rules closed the loophole for Amateur
> > retransmission of NOAA broadcasts. Period. I've already gotten two legal
> > opinions about this, one coming from the ARRL General Counsel.
> >
> > https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/97.113
> >
> > 73, David KB4FXC
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 4 Apr 2018, "Jay Urish via arm-allstar" wrote:
> >
> > > Small topic hijack.
> > >
> > > Doug, You are incorrect.
> > >
> > > copied from - http://www.repeater-builder.com/tech-info/weather-radios.
> > html
> > >
> > > see section -- Weather Receiver Rebroadcasts and the Legal Questions
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > As to what can be rebroadcast, Dan directed me to Part 97.113(e) which
> > > reads:
> > >
> > >     "No station shall retransmit programs or signals emanating from any
> > >     type of radio station other than an amateur station, except
> > >     propagation and weather forecast information intended for use by the
> > >     general public and originated from United States Government stations
> > >     and communications, including incidental music, originating on
> > >     United States Government frequencies between a space shuttle and its
> > >     associated Earth stations."
> > >
> > >
> > > On 04/04/2018 09:57 AM, "Doug Crompton via arm-allstar" wrote:
> > > > Stephen,
> > > >
> > > >     It is not legal to rebroadcast NOAA weather on amateur radio. That
> > rule
> > > > has been in existence for quite some time. Otherwise what you want to
> > do
> > > > could probably be accomplished through a script timing the various
> > > > scenarios.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > *73 Doug*
> > > >
> > > > *WA3DSP*
> > > >
> > > > *http://www.crompton.com/hamradio <http://www.crompton.com/hamradio>*
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 10:00 AM, "Stephen - K1LNX via arm-allstar" <
> > > > arm-allstar at hamvoip.org> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Before I potentially re-invent the wheel, I wondered if something
> > like this
> > > >> exists in the app_rpt code.
> > > >>
> > > >> I have a dedicated channelized remote base node and steer it with the
> > BCD
> > > >> control script. I put our local NOAA weather radio in one of the
> > channels,
> > > >> and would like the ability to call it up "on-command" for audio.
> > > >>
> > > >> Ideally, I'd like to call a function that will:
> > > >>
> > > >> - change channels to my pre-defined WX channel in the CDM radio via
> > the BCD
> > > >> script
> > > >> - Playback audio for 2-3 minutes
> > > >> - change back to my "default" channel after the timer has elapsed and
> > > >> disconnect
> > > >>
> > > >> Unless I've missed it, I don't see a function in app_rpt to
> > facilitate this
> > > >> behavior? So that left me thinking of options, and I am looking to
> > see if
> > > >> anyone has any other ideas:
> > > >>
> > > >> - use my controller (SCOM 7330) to send a DTMF command to call a
> > script,
> > > >> run on a timer, then send another DTMF command to disconnect it (this
> > would
> > > >> be easiest, but my preferred use to call scripts and functions is to
> > use
> > > >> MDC instead which the SCOM does not support)
> > > >>
> > > >> - write a shell or python script to handle this
> > > >>
> > > >> - hack something together in the dialplan, I think I might be able to
> > > >> leverage the autopatch function for this, but haven't looked into it
> > yet.
> > > >>
> > > >> Looking for ideas if anyone has any, and perhaps I'm overthinking this
> > > >> which I'm known to do on occasion ;)
> > > >>
> > > >> 73
> > > >> Stephen
> > > >> K1LNX
> > > >> _______________________________________________
> > > >>
> > > >> arm-allstar mailing list
> > > >> arm-allstar at hamvoip.org
> > > >> http://lists.hamvoip.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/arm-allstar
> > > >>
> > > >> Visit the BBB and RPi2/3 web page - http://hamvoip.org
> > > >>
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > >
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> > > >
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> > >
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> > >
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> > >
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> > >
> >
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> >
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